MoparFins

General BS and Laughs => General Mopar Discussions => Topic started by: Jason Goldsack on June 03, 2011, 04:27:00 PM

Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 03, 2011, 04:27:00 PM
I was going to change the plugs on our 1998 Dodge pickup with a 5.2 magnum...

It turns out the plug and wires are original and so are the STUPID METAL SHIELDS AROUND THE PLUG BOOTS...

You can't get a socket on it.. and they won't come out..

My buddy says I can try to use penetrating oil on them for a couple days to free them up or break them off and grind down a socket to fit inside what it left..

THIS SUCKS!!

Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 03, 2011, 04:45:21 PM
The plug protectors do come out without too much problem, I got mine out of the 3.9 with a pair of pliers. There is a seam on them, just have to squeeze them enough to close that space and twist them out back and forth. No reason why you can't get a sparkplug socket inside the shields, again, I didn't have a problem. Are you sure they aren't the 5/8ths peanut plugs like mine?
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 03, 2011, 04:47:33 PM


But if there are no conditions keeping the socket out, you're using the wrong one.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 03, 2011, 05:12:54 PM
I just got the champion plugs the part store said I needed... it takes a 13/16 socket and there is NO way it fits in the shield..


Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 03, 2011, 07:17:24 PM
Go look at the spark plug itself. Like I said, mine are the peanut 5/8ths inch sparkplugs, not the 13/16ths. If the socket doesn't fit, something is wrong because the 5/8ths socket is a close fit as it is.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Snotty on June 03, 2011, 08:07:35 PM
Quote from: 1965Windsor361
I just got the champion plugs the part store said I needed... it takes a 13/16 socket and there is NO way it fits in the shield..


 
No it does not use the 13/16, but the smaller spark plug socket common to imports.  It's a common mistake for shops to sell you plugs for that motor that have the 13/16 bottom.  Those are incorrect and will not fit.  I had it happen to me twice while I owned my 5.2 Magnum van.
 
Unfortunately, I just looked at my smaller socket but can't read the size.  It was actually on a lable that has been wiped off.
 
If you have a set of deeps, try those, one will fit.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Snotty on June 03, 2011, 08:09:36 PM
If the factory label is still inside your truck's hood, the correct size of plug should be listed on it.  Take that number to your shop and buy those plugs, not the ones the guy at the counter, reading a computer, tells you are correct.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 04, 2011, 02:46:29 AM
Ya.. I checked that I'll have to go back..


Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 04, 2011, 06:58:51 AM


Parts guys are stupid
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 04, 2011, 08:05:56 AM
I went back and the same guy from last night was there again..

I showed him on the receipt that he looked up 1989 Dodge 1500 not 1998 Dodge 1500.. GRRRRRR

I got the right plugs and they are 5/8 plugs..

Now should I need to remove the heat shields or can I change the plugs with them in place?



Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 04, 2011, 09:22:39 AM
Keep them in place, they do keep things cleaner around the inside recess of the spark plugs for next time you change them, hopefully not twelve years down the road!
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Stitcherbob on June 04, 2011, 09:36:31 AM

Quote from: POLARACO

Parts guys are stupid

correction:

TODAY'S parts guys are stupid





when I worked at NAPA in 1985 we didn't need no steenkin computers.....we had 2 things....

knowledge and books!

Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 04, 2011, 12:19:23 PM


U telling me you are an exception?
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 04, 2011, 01:37:22 PM

20 minutes and the new plugs are in...

They all had great color just worn.. the gap was pretty large... good to not see any traces of an oil leak or anything crazy like that..

Now... will the mileage go up?



1965Windsor3612011-06-04 21:24:39
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 04, 2011, 03:38:32 PM


You using the wrong socket was right too.  But I see it was simple Monkey See - Monkey do in your case.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 04, 2011, 04:09:26 PM
It might go up, depending on how far off it was.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 04, 2011, 04:24:04 PM

Quote from: POLARACO


? I don't understand...




Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 04, 2011, 06:38:06 PM
Quote from: 1965Windsor361
Quote from: POLARACO
Well I was almost 100% right out of the box.
 

You saw the sparkplug and simply assumed it was 13/16ths without verifying the sparkplug itself. Monkey see, monkey do, not checking the engine part when the socket didn't fit. Kind of funny really.....bet if you tried hard enough you could have gotten those bigger plugs to fit in there.....almost(http://www.moparfins.com/forum/smileys/smiley2.gif).
 
Don't feel bad, it happens. It's kind of like the bolts that fit  but don't. Your engine, like mine, has both SAE and metric bolts and threads, so if a bolt starts OK then gets tight, well, time to check the bolt, not crank it in and mess up the bolt and threads. Same thing....it fits!
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 04, 2011, 07:45:49 PM


But thanks for explaining it to Jason. . . .
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 04, 2011, 10:10:45 PM
true.

that's what taps are for!!!!!!!(http://www.moparfins.com/forum/smileys/smiley2.gif)dana442011-06-05 03:11:41
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 05, 2011, 04:25:01 AM
I bought the plugs and said give me the socket for the plugs so i don't have to look for mine ( which is somewhere in my tool box)..

I got home.. and when the socket didn't fit in the shield I stopped and posted on here and called my buddy before I did anything.

He told me that I needed to remove the shields.. Steve said leave them..

I went right under the hood and checked what I was supposed to run from the sticker.. Then I felt really stupid for actually going home from the parts store with the wrong parts when the truck was parked outside and I could have verified that the parts were wrong all along..

Lesson learned but at least I didn't try to change anything without finding out the right part first.

That's why it's great to have a place to go when I have questions....like here..



Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 05, 2011, 06:52:22 AM
Jason,  it's great we are here to razz each other. Don't feel bad, I buy parts and wait weeks to install them at times, but I can't honestly remember the last time I had the wrong part sitting around before getting to it. It's one thing to change an oil filter every six months because I am running synthetic oil, another not to know what sparkplugs are under the hood because they have never been changed.
 
Now, did you get new wires and cap and rotor for her, too?
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 05, 2011, 07:14:32 AM


That's, in part, why Polaraco has been up in the air for the last few days.  I measured the tailpipes when I ordered my Cat Converters.  (Don't ask),  They are 2 1/2".  So they come and look big.  So with the car up in the air, I measure the exhaust pipe.  2 1/4"  OK  I re-order and send these back.  Get the new ones and go to work.  THE DUMMY THAT DID THE EXHAUST FOR ME WENT FROM 2 1/4" TO 2" TO 2 1/2".  (http://www.moparfins.com/forum/smileys/smiley36.gif) Makes no sense at all.  Why he stepped down then up again.. . .     So there it sits up in the air waiting for all the adaptors so I can Micky Mouse it now,  Same thing as your problem.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 05, 2011, 11:06:43 AM
I put wires on it... but haven't attempted the cap and rotor...

There is barely enough room to get to it let alone take it off. I'm gonna have to have a plan before I try that... It's hard on the belly to lay over the rad to reach the back.. mostly on my hernia scar..







Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Snotty on June 05, 2011, 03:34:42 PM
Quote from: POLARACO
   THE DUMMY THAT DID THE EXHAUST FOR ME WENT FROM 2 1/4" TO 2" TO 2 1/2".  (http://www.moparfins.com/forum/smileys/smiley36.gif) Makes no sense at all.  Why he stepped down then up again.. . .    


 
Why?  Becasue that is very common today Steve.  I'll bet your new truck has the same issue; my '93 Van did.  It was 2.5" to the cat and then to the muffler, but 3' from there out.   I think it has something to do with polutants, but it is very common.
 
Back to Jason - if your gas milage is bad, or has gone away, look to your cat.  (The one under your truck, not your trailer.)  This is a guess, but when they go bad they take the mileage with them.  My van went from 18 on the highway to 14.  When I replaced the cat it returned 21!  I made no other changes.  Just a thought....
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 05, 2011, 04:01:44 PM
That's a thought... what is one of them worth..





Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 05, 2011, 04:02:31 PM

Quote from: 1965Windsor361
I put wires on it... but haven't attempted the cap and rotor...

There is barely enough room to get to it let alone take it off. I'm gonna have to have a plan before I try that... It's hard on the belly to lay over the rad to reach the back.. mostly on my hernia scar..






I would suggest you soak those secrew on the cap with PB blaster a few times.  Use a socket on it and be gentle.  Unless someone lubed those screws, they are known to freeze up in the disty.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 05, 2011, 04:05:24 PM

Quote from: Snotty
Quote from: POLARACO
   THE DUMMY THAT DID THE EXHAUST FOR ME WENT FROM 2 1/4" TO 2" TO 2 1/2".  (http://www.moparfins.com/forum/smileys/smiley36.gif) Makes no sense at all.  Why he stepped down then up again.. . .    


 
Why?  Becasue that is very common today Steve.  I'll bet your new truck has the same issue; my '93 Van did.  It was 2.5" to the cat and then to the muffler, but 3' from there out.   I think it has something to do with polutants, but it is very common.
 
The Truck is 4" all the way through
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Snotty on June 05, 2011, 09:42:22 PM
[/QUOTE]


 
Are you asking what they cost?  On the van, that had the same motor as your truck, I paid less that $150.00 installed.  But, be sure yours is bad before you pay for a new one.  I'm just "spitballing" a suggestion about your milage.  Even so, a bad cat and bad milaeage often go hand in hand.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 05, 2011, 11:18:19 PM
I know it did great on the emission test ... I think it must be working somewhat to pass the sniffer?

Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 06, 2011, 06:27:44 AM



They suck in mileage to begin with.  remember it's a 4 X 4.  Driving habits too.
POLARACO2011-06-06 11:28:32
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 06, 2011, 09:35:20 AM
When a cat gets plugged (not the one in the metal pile), the exhaust will smell like rotten eggs. You can also hit the cat (notthe one in the metal pile) with a mallet and if it sounds solid, it can be plugged up, they tend to rattle when the pellets inside are still active.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 06, 2011, 10:28:06 AM
The trucks used a honeycomb
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Snotty on June 06, 2011, 11:43:55 AM
Quote from: dana44
When a cat gets plugged (not the one in the metal pile), the exhaust will smell like rotten eggs.


 
Not always.  That was very true when they were introduced in 1975.
 
Jason, my Stratus passed Smog and it's cat is shot.  It measured 57 PPM out of an allowable 58.  That's still passing.  In two years it will not pass.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 06, 2011, 12:05:54 PM
I can hear Snotty's wallet squeaking again. . . .
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: firedome on June 06, 2011, 12:11:53 PM
Can't a "cheap" generic cat be adapted to work?

Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 06, 2011, 01:01:12 PM
Quote from: Snotty
Quote from: dana44
When a cat gets plugged (not the one in the metal pile), the exhaust will smell like rotten eggs.


 
Not always.  That was very true when they were introduced in 1975.
 
Yeah, things change, figures I didn't have the update on that one.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 06, 2011, 02:53:16 PM
Mine isn't a 4 wheel drive...





Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 06, 2011, 04:17:52 PM


What kind of mileage are we talking about here?
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 06, 2011, 04:20:22 PM
We drive the speed limit, the od and converter are working great.. I can feel each engaging.

It gets about 14 highway right now..



Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 06, 2011, 04:21:51 PM


Quote from: POLARACO

Ahhh  Unusual up there.

Oh ya... I forgot about the snow storms here in August ... I should have got a 4 x4 to move ice blocks for my igloo..

(http://www.moparfins.com/forum/smileys/smiley36.gif)

1965Windsor3612011-06-06 21:22:21
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Snotty on June 06, 2011, 07:12:56 PM
Quote from: firedome
Can't a "cheap" generic cat be adapted to work?


 
Don't know.  I thought $150 was not bad.  I know of a guy who needs one on his S15 something, and the same guy that installed mine said the cheapest is $275.  Eeek! 
 
And Steve, you're right!  I am cheap!  I don't want to find out that the one in the Stratus is like the one for my friend's Chevy. 
 
At the same time I know the Stratus would run better if I changed it.  Like today, the idle speed was constantly changing while I was sitting in the car and texting Frances.  I'll bet it's sending all kinds of wrong signals to the computer....
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Snotty on June 06, 2011, 07:14:48 PM
[/QUOTE]


 
If this is "around town" driving, or even on rural roads, that's not bad.  My van got 11 in town, and 18-20 on the highway.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 06, 2011, 08:55:39 PM
Rear end gears and overall tire size can make quite a difference in mileage with the trucks, too.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 07, 2011, 03:51:55 AM
It has 3.55 and 95% of the time it is highway.. and the road is a 50 mph highway...

Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 07, 2011, 07:17:30 AM


Change the fuel filter
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Snotty on June 07, 2011, 09:15:14 AM
It could just be the difference between a truck and a van.  My van had 3.50 gears in a  9.25 rear.  Even though a van is a moving billboard, a truck creates a lot of vacuum via the bed.  That vacuum will eat some MPG.  I put a tonneau cover on my Dakota and gained 1 MPG.   A friend did the same with his full-sized Chevy and saw an increase of 3.
 
If all else is as it should be it becomes a crapshoot.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 07, 2011, 01:23:57 PM
I did look in the throttle body and it was pretty dirty.. that's first on the cleaning list..injector cleaner is on the list too..

Where the is the fuel filter on one of these?



Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 07, 2011, 03:11:25 PM


By the way, rail pressure is like 60 PSI on that
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 07, 2011, 03:42:37 PM
It will be an in the tank filter, my  Dakota was, and that was 1995, so no filter to change.
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 07, 2011, 03:59:07 PM
Ya.. that is how it is like in my Neon and Sebring...no filter.

I still think a hand held programmer is my only hope. The stock program sucks. There was a running program change for the 1998 and up truck. When it went in for a dealership check-up most got the new program flashed. Mine has an update of Sept 2000...

My buddy who gets 24 MPG out of his 1998 with a 5.2 has an update date of early 98. His never had the update program put in it.. He has to run mid-grade to keep from pinging. He says the extra mileage more than makes up for having to buy the mid-grade gas.

The program change was to fix the pinging on regular gas the 5.2 was having. They must have backed off the timing and played with the fuel map. I learned this from a Mopar Dealership.

I guess I could look through the wrecking yard and look at the flashing date on the front of the computer or get a programmer and change the program in the CPU that way..





Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Steve on June 07, 2011, 07:22:34 PM


Speaking of emmision shtuff
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Jason Goldsack on June 08, 2011, 03:50:21 AM
I wonder about that too...

This truck did sit for a while.

Once and a while it sounds like it misfires.. not often..

I wonder if the cap may have a crack or something.



Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Snotty on June 09, 2011, 08:01:59 PM
[/QUOTE]


 
Snotty2011-06-10 01:03:47
Title: WTF!!!!!
Post by: Guests on June 09, 2011, 09:52:21 PM
A new cap, rotor and plug wires, cleaned/replaced PCV valve are always good things to improve mileage, and if it hasn't been done, think of it as payment for all the years it wasn't replaced. Also, spark plug gap set to what is under the hood. The old ones used to be .032-.035, the newer ones are all the way up to .050 and if it is too small, well, mileage can suffer.

Another thing that can help mileage is cleaning and repacking the front wheel bearings. Had a 62 Caddy Hearse that I would drop mileage down to 15mpg, clean and pack the wheel bearings once a year and be back to its normal 17mpg (and she was 7950lbs empty).dana442011-06-10 02:55:01