MoparFins

Techical Discussions => Tech- - Engine => Topic started by: attkrlufy on June 15, 2009, 07:39:21 AM

Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: attkrlufy on June 15, 2009, 07:39:21 AM
As you can see - my engine is "sludgy."  There's all these fine particles embedded in this sludge that seems to be everywhere.  It doesn't wipe off, either.  It's like....an oil-glue-sand mixture.

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3391/3629577726_5ce747b303.jpg)

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3313/3628766395_5867c6a1e0.jpg)

I imagine it would be smart to de-grease the now-open engine cavity and valves, but I don't know:
A) if it's worth it, or
B) how I would even begin to do it while leaving everything in place, and
C) not leave a residue of cleaner that would kill the internals of the engine

Any thoughts?


Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Stan Paralikis on June 15, 2009, 08:17:39 AM
Bad news: that suckuh needs to be stripped down to the bare block and tank dipped.
Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: attkrlufy on June 15, 2009, 09:23:32 AM

Quote from: Commando1
Bad news: that suckuh needs to be stripped down to the bare block and tank dipped.
As in: A) in order to properly clean it, or B) it'll seize up and explode tomorrow if you don't.

Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Robert Rottman on June 15, 2009, 09:33:11 AM
As long as this engine was running fairly well before you removed this intake,  if you don't want to dismantle, hot tank and rebuild the engine, leave it alone and see what happens. If you start cleaning that sludge up I bet you'll wind up clogging all the little holes and oil passageways and engine failure will be soon at hand....but that's just my 2 cents...I hope others chime in here...
 
furyfever2009-06-15 14:36:25
Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Steve on June 15, 2009, 12:02:56 PM
Nah  That aint sludge.  I've seen a heck of allot worse.
 
You can run some Marvel Mystry Oil in there between changes.  That will help disolve all that crap.
 
Not to worry. . She'll be fine.  Drive it up here when done.  No biggie.
Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Snotty on June 15, 2009, 08:17:29 PM
I've seen sludge so thick you could write your name in it!  Yours looks like it went a few miles between oil changes, but is not that bad.
 
However, dumping anything into the motor can loosen that stuff up - to the potential detriment of the motor.  If it was running well put it back together and continue driving it.  Change the oil often, and avoid Pennzoil.  If you do use a flush I'd suggest changing your oil after 1,000 miles for three times.
Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Rich on June 15, 2009, 08:31:28 PM
 Looks like a few too many years of Quaker State or Pennzoil !  I don't know what those two companies use for base stock and additives, but every engine I've ever worked on that looked ugly like that was run on one or the other of those two oils. Some diesel oils will do this to gasoline engines because they have too much ash.  I've seen engines that were run on Valvoline and Havoline that have been clean enough to eat off of. 

 You could run some motor flush through it, and then start a regimen of using some good oil and changing the filter every 250 miles and oil every 500 miles until the filters are clean (cut them open to see how much gunk they've collected).

Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Steve on June 16, 2009, 05:16:13 AM
Oh yeah. . .make sure you clean out those cross overs.  They are plugged solid.  I imagine that's what started all this.
 
What you see is typical of allot of short runs.
Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: attkrlufy on June 16, 2009, 07:20:55 AM

Quote from: POLARACO
Nah  That aint sludge.  I've seen a heck of allot worse.  You can run some Marvel Mystry Oil in there between changes.  That will help disolve all that crap.  Not to worry, She'll be fine.  Drive it up here when done.
Good to know.  That'll cut a lot of time off this project.

Quote from: SNOTTY
However, dumping anything into the motor can loosen that stuff up - to the potential detriment of the motor.
Quote from: KRAUTMASTER
You could run some motor flush through it, and then start a regimen of
using some good oil and changing the filter every 250 miles and oil
every 500 miles....
A friend of mine once told me that draining the oil out of the engine and replacing it with tranny fluid works great for flushing out "gunk."  After the car gets hot, you then drain the tranny fluid and put new oil back in, and - according to him - "yer good to go."

Anyone else hear of this?  It sounds like one of those things that's so stupid it just might work. (http://www.moparfins.com/forum/smileys/smiley29.gif)

Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: attkrlufy on June 16, 2009, 07:25:54 AM

Quote from: POLARACO
Oh yeah. . .make sure you clean out those cross overs.  They are plugged solid.  I imagine that's what started all this.
Working on it.  I've got them mostly clean:
Driver side:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3402/3629577508_63d2f5a0ba.jpg)

Pass side:
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2421/3628765053_6e38f132c9.jpg)

But you can see I still have some carbon to take off.  Do they make tools for this?  Right now I'm using a flathead screwdriver and hammer.  I feel like one of those chimps in the beginning of 2001. (http://www.moparfins.com/forum/smileys/smiley7.gif)

Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Steve on June 16, 2009, 08:37:34 AM
nope.  Try a small chissle.  The plastic handles on the drivers lose some of the hammer impact.
 
Other than that, a shop vac and what you are doing. . .
 
Wait until you get to the intake!
 
When you get this all back together. . .  Take a soda can and clean it out.  Fill it with water.  Drive the car to full operating temps.  Make sure it's hot.  Take the air cleaner off and slowly pour the water down the carb.  Bon't let it stall.  It will steam the cylinders and intake to get more of that out.  If you do that once a year or so, you'll be fine.
 
Wait until you see the mileage go up now.  The choke will open much faster
Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Snotty on June 16, 2009, 08:41:13 PM
Concerning the flush, I just use a good can of Motor Flush and follow the directions.  I ahve heard that the best way to be sure all is lean after is to drop the pan and clean the pickup and the bottom of the pan of all the gunk that will collect.
Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Steve on June 17, 2009, 07:55:04 AM
I wouldn't be that aggressive on a old motor Scott
Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Snotty on June 19, 2009, 06:08:20 AM
If you flush an old motor you might as well be complete with what you're doing.  I flushed a motor but didn't drop the pan and you, personally, know the results.  Chris had suggested I do it.  Had I done so, would you have found what you did when the 413 was torn down?
 
I don't know, but it brings us back to what was siad by someone earlier: if it was running fine before, put it back together and don't worry about sludge and build-up.  Just change the oil on regular intervals.  At @ 140,000 miles that motor will/might be a good candidate for a rebuild.  But you have a few good years before that need.
Title: Engine sludge removal - worth it?
Post by: Tom Dawson on June 19, 2009, 04:08:29 PM
That ain't no sludge-that is normal from the crossover being plugged up-I had a 77 Olds Cutlass Supreme 2dr hrdtp rocket 350-the valley was plugged almost to the underside of the intake with sludge I wandered how the motor ever stayed together with the way I beat on it.
Tom